I saw a question by a fellow Transtastic resident that I found interesting. Maybe this has been covered before, but I thought it might make for a useful topic/tip.

She asked: Are there foods a guy can take to make him more feminine??

I went and googled this info, so it's not guaranteed to be 100% accurate.

What do you know about this subject? What's been your experience?

One site stated the following: (American spelling of Oestrogen used)

http://www.modernmom.com/article/what-foods-contain-natural-estrogen


Estrogen is found naturally in many foods, while other foods may inhibit estrogen. Some of the same foods that offer natural estrogen also offer other valuable nutrients that are important to a healthy diet. It is always recommended to eat a wide variety of healthy foods rather than focusing on only a few. The effects of estrogen should also be discussed with your doctor to ensure it is a healthy plan for you.


Seeds

Many seeds contain natural estrogen. Some examples of these seeds include anise seeds, flaxseeds, sesame seeds and sunflower seeds. Some of these seeds, such as sunflower seeds, may be consumed as snacks. Others are easy to add to other foods such as baked goods.


Grains

Certain grains provide a good source of natural estrogen. Wheat, alfalfa, barley, oats and rice contain estrogen. Using these grains in your cooking will provide a natural source of estrogen in your meals.


Vegetables

Not all vegetables contain natural estrogen. Some vegetables may actually inhibit estrogen. Yet some vegetables are a good source of estrogen. These vegetables include beets, carrots, cucumbers, eggplant, peas, peppers, potatoes, split peas and yams. Vegetables offer many other valuable nutrients, making them a good component to any diet.


Fruits

Most fruits are estrogen inhibitors. There are some exceptions though. Apples, cherries, tomatoes, pomegranates and plums are fruits which provide natural estrogen. These fruits are a healthy way to include sweet flavors in your diet while also adding natural estrogen.


Beans

A variety of beans offer the added bonus of natural estrogen. Chickpeas, black-eyed peas, red beans and soybeans add estrogen to the diet. These beans are often found in soups or casseroles. They may also be consumed alone.


Other

Eggs, dairy products, garlic, baker's yeast, clover, olive oil, olives, parsley and sage also offer the benefits of natural estrogen. These food products can be added to the diet in a variety of ways, either by themselves or in other dishes.


Estrogen Inhibiting Foods

Some foods naturally inhibit estrogen. This can be beneficial if you suffer from a condition that may be exacerbated by estrogen. This list of foods includes berries, grapes, melons, pineapples, pears, squash, green beans, cabbage, broccoli, citrus foods, corn, onions, millet, buckwheat, white rice and white flour.

Another bit of info gleaned from the internet:

Did you know that the food you eat can make you more or LESS of a woman? It’s true!

Amazingly, over 300 different foods contain phytoestrogens (plant estrogens). These foods probably won’t feminize you on their own, but they CAN give you an extra boost if you use herbs for breast enlargement or are on hormone therapy.

Here are 3 feminizing foods to incorporate into your diet:


1. Flax seeds

Flax seeds contain more phytoestrogens than any other food, so it’s a great idea to eat them daily. Try sprinkling ground flax seeds on cereal, yogurt, fruit and salads. (Note: They need to be ground so you can digest them and get the phytoestrogenic effect.)


2. Soy

Soy is another high-phytoestrogen food. There are tons of soy foods available, so it’s easy to work them into your diet. Try: tofu, soy beans, soy milk, soy yogurt, soy powder, soy burgers, etc.


3. Fruits and veggies

There are also lots of fruits and vegetables that contain phytoestrogens. High-phytoestrogen fruits include: dried prunes, peaches, raspberries and strawberries. High-phytoestrogen veggies include: alfalfa sprouts, Winter squash, green beans, collard greens, broccoli and cabbage.
Best of all, these foods also encourage weight loss. (Remember: the heavier you are, the harder it is to create a feminine body shape.)

It’s just as important to AVOID anti-feminizing foods. Here are 2 foods that increase testosterone and have a masculinizing effect:


1. Simple carbs

Simple carbs, like sugar or white bread, increase your insulin level. Since increased insulin is related to testosterone production, it’s important not to overeat these foods.


2. High zinc foods

Zinc is another substance that boosts testosterone levels. That means you should avoid high-zinc foods like oysters, beef, pork, turkey, chicken liver, pumpkin seeds if you’re on a feminizing program.

I'm not sure about foods to eat that assist in feminisation but the following from practical experience, (blush) can as a man, both increase your virility and protect against prostate cancer. Anything high in zinc, e.g. pumpkin seeds, pine nuts, brazil nuts and almonds, tomatoes, green tea, jacket potatoes (high in serotonin) necessary for your brain to function. I personally eat on a daily basis, porridge, seeded wholemeal bread, mixed steamed vegatables, fruit, and low fat yoghurts and a couple of generous lumps of dark chocolate. I don't touch alcohol, or red meat or anything fried, apart from the odd treat. All of which helps me to be 'a vision of feminine/masculine loveliness' depending what mood I'm in....

This is a very interesting post. Thanks for posting, Adele. I eat lots of tofu, and many of the other foods that naturally increase estrogen, but I also eat some foods which inhibit it. As they say, everything in moderation. For example, caffeine inhibits estrogen , but I must have my morning coffee or else mutate into a grouchy monster.

I did a lot of research into phytoestrogens a few years ago and for a year I tried a lot of different herbs and suppliments myself to see if they had any effect. I read and learned loads about the subject. All the different foods and herbs that were supposed to contain phytoestrogens and in what amounts. One thing not widely understood is that phytoestrogens are not actually present in the food untill consumed and processed by the body. The compounds are "believed" to be manufactured in the body as the food or herbs are processed. Anyway I came to the conclusion that for a mature male the quantities of active phytoestrogens were just not enough to make any difference. I did a lot of reading into the matter and the ammounts of testoterone in a typical male just completly overwhelm the compounds. Sure many foods and herbs work for women as a kind of HRT and possibly a teenage boy would notice the effects.
It is a bit of a quest of mine to make this known to other TG folk because many of us get to feeling quite desperate at times and fall for the claims of various products that promise all kinds of great results. They are not cheap either. One of the oldest TG shops in UK is Transformation. It was founded by a TG woman over 30 years ago I think. But they of all people should not be offering such false hope for people. they should know better and have more compassion. A few months back after reading some of their adverts via a link on Facebook I wrote an email to them. I asked what were the active ingredients in the products and in what quantities. Not surprisingly I got no reply.
They dont even admit that the products are phytoestrogen compounds but rather skirt round the issue calling them oestrogen activators or something like that. I feel sorry for people who invest in several months supply of these pils and potions and are let down badly.

BTW for Michael Wallace :- Saw Palmletto is suposed to be a DHT inhibitor ie. a herbal substitute for Propecia which is used for limiting male pattern balding and treating enlarged protate. :-)

Gini I'm largely with you on this one. I do eat phytoestrogens but mainly because I quite like them and I do find minor changes mainly in my body hair and mood but let me re-iterate it is minor.
One point you raise is that any effect is swamped by the testosterone produced by a normal male. Remember 'normal' will mean that some will produce more and some less. Therefore the effect will be greater for some rather than others. As for being expensive, ground hemp and soya milk is available cheaply in most supermarkets these days and constitute the highest sources. Also they do nothing to harm a 'normal' diet.

Fair comment Josephine. I eat foods "containing" phytoestrogens myself. Soya milk, Fennel tea, even beer ( believe it or not Hops have a high content too) But I think you can see that what I was griping about was the so called breast enhancing pills, creams and potions. Regarding my defintion of "the normal male" I mean normal testosterone levels can be anywhere between 300 and 1100ng/dl. Where as a woman may be average about 50ng/dl.
and a boy going through puberty may start at around 30ng/dl.and slowly climb to "average" 500ng/dl. by 19years.
But as you can see these amounts are huge compared to a woman and the only real research done on the positive effects of phytoestrogens regarding altering hormone balance has only been done with females and you can easily see that phyto estogens are going to have a real battle trying to compete with those amounts of testosterone.
One of the most important medications in a traditional hormone program for a M to F TG person is the anti-androgen needed to reduce the natural testosterone. otherwise the amounts of oestrogen ect needed would probably be quite life threatening.

Does anyone know the average age for a man's testosterone level to start dropping due to aging?

Oh no it seems to be me again. I think people are going to get sick of my input. But anyway I think I read that it starts to drop off late in the forties but its quite a gradual decline

eating Haagen Dazs Ice cream whilst wearing pyjamas and fluffy slippers, and making small humming sounds with every spoon you eat makes you look girly... does that count... lol
This post was edited by Deleted Member at January 5, 2013 1:47 AM GMT

From personal experience, I'd agree with Gina on her observations as to when a man's testerone level drops. Of course whilsthe mightnot able to 'perform' with the same frequency he could in the years before that. Some men can still enjoy an active sex life well into their 80's. So I've still some time to go.

I started herbal supplements this week. Black cohosh and saw palmetto three times a day plus a soy isoflaven once a day. In addition, I use soy milk almost every morning, plus soy protein powder and/or soy protein bars on days I go to the gym.

<blockquote><strong><a href="/se4/profile/ginimitchell">Gini Mitchell</a> said:</strong><br />Fair comment Josephine. I eat foods "containing" phytoestrogens myself. Soya milk, Fennel tea, even beer ( believe it or not Hops have a high content too) But I think you can see that what I was griping about was the so called breast enhancing pills, creams and potions. Regarding my defintion of "the normal male" I mean normal testosterone levels can be anywhere between 300 and 1100ng/dl. Where as a woman may be average about 50ng/dl.
and a boy going through puberty may start at around 30ng/dl.and slowly climb to "average" 500ng/dl. by 19years.
But as you can see these amounts are huge compared to a woman and the only real research done on the positive effects of phytoestrogens regarding altering hormone balance has only been done with females and you can easily see that phyto estogens are going to have a real battle trying to compete with those amounts of testosterone.
One of the most important medications in a traditional hormone program for a M to F TG person is the anti-androgen needed to reduce the natural testosterone. otherwise the amounts of oestrogen ect needed would probably be quite life threatening.</blockquote><br />

hi gini ,as regarding phytos in food you would have to eat sack loads every day to get whats in a few pills and put loads of weight on.

<blockquote><strong><a href="/se4/profile/lizwilby">liz wilby</a> said:</strong><br />hi gini ,as regarding phytos in food you would have to eat sack loads every day to get whats in a few pills and put loads of weight on.</blockquote><br />

Agreed love thats what I was attempting to get across. but I had a bit of opposition so I gave up. Some girls feel better about them selves I suppose if they are taking some kind of meds even if they are just brewing up expensive pee in reality

This is a thought with no scientific basis. Given the normal male testosterone level is about 500 and a oestrogen level at maybe 30. If that person were to start on hormone replacement treatment, the levels need to be reversed. The anti-androgen will reduce the testosterone and the oestrogen patches will build that level. However, I wouldn't have thought the level of oestrogen given could be as high as the final requirement as your body would not be used to that level. I do know that the oestrogen patches are increased over the period of transition. If you start from a higher base as supplied by eating the right foods this must help. Also the longer your body has been used to this the easier it must be to ramp up the real dosage. The level of oestrogen supplied by these foods cannot be negligible otherwise they would not work as a HRT for those who do not like taking medicine and must supply the same as over the counter HRT compounds.

I think this will be good and better for feminizing.